45: Conventional Commits vs. Release-It and Chatting About the Changelog

0:00What's going on, everybody? Welcome to another whiskey web and whatnot with myself, Robert William Wagner, the first and your favorite co-host, Charles William Carpenter, the third. I'm also the only co-host, right? I'm the only option for co-hosts. Well, yeah, just wanted to say different words than I always say. Fair enough. So today is different in many ways. We usually buy whiskey that we're really excited about and think will be pretty good and they're a little more expensive than I might buy myself usually. But we did not do that this time. We have the Howlerhead banana whiskey, which says on the bottle, it is guaranteed not to contain

0:56ape shit. So that's good. Yeah, what about monkeys, though? You know, like if our apes and monkeys, they could have monkey shit. It's got monkey spirit in it. That is true. It says Howlerhead and monkey spirit. So they captured the spirit of a monkey in here. I haven't decided if that's a good or bad thing. But yeah, the idea of straight bourbon whiskey with natural banana flavor doesn't sound great to me. I mean, it's not like, yeah, it's not like cinnamon flavor or some of those weird ones. But still, yeah, it's not a flavor that lends itself to whiskey usually. I wouldn't think. Yeah. It even says somewhere I think on the back that's like, let's see,

1:31yeah, people said we were mucking around. They said convention is not to be trifled with. We heard them. There are full cities of people not trifling with convention for the rest of us. Welcome to the jungle. Yeah. So they're purposefully doing something different. Yeah. So 80 proof, 40% alcohol, we don't know anything about mash bill of base. But I guess what really doesn't matter when you're flavoring it. No. So yeah, I mean, the things you need to know are they partner with the UFC. And it's like kind of owned by Dana White, but I couldn't really figure that out. Like he's in charge, but like another brand like Wooler Brands owns the whistle like makes and distributes the whiskey

2:12or something like that. And who's Dana White? How about that? I don't know. He's the guy that started the UFC. Oh, yeah. No, I don't. I watch one sport. I'm not really interested in any other. Yeah, I don't know much about the UFC either. I just know of him because like one famous guy named Dana tends to be something that you remember. But yeah. So I've seen pictures of him. He's pretty big. Looks like he would be a fighting guy. Okay. Fair enough. I was like, did you get that right? Did you mean Vanna White or Dana Carvey? Or nope. Someone else I've actually heard of? No. Okay. Nope. I'm pretty sure I got that right. Anyway, let's try it out. Let's have it. Let's get this over with.

2:58I figure even if it's terrible, I can use it to like flambé bananas for desserts and stuff like. Yeah. It's true. And be kind of in the bananas foster sort of thing. But fun fact, my favorite flavor is fake banana. So unfortunately, this is real bananas, but I might like it. Right. Well, the smell is very banana forward, but also like mustier. Maybe that's just the whiskey trying to get past the banana. Yeah. Like you approach it. It's got a little bit of paint in there, but then it gets real banana. Yeah. Like it smells like a popsicle that someone poured a bunch of whiskey into. Well, it's not horrible. It's a flavored whiskey. Yeah. I don't know. I almost feel like

3:54I take this to a party. Kind of like, oh, funny guys. Let's all have some of this, but I wouldn't wouldn't get home from work. You know, start cooking a nice steak and pour myself a glass of this. That's not what I would do. Yeah. No, I think I agree. Like I think it's surprisingly good for what it is. And it knows it's not like the highest quality whiskey. It's not trying to be. And I get that. Like, yeah, I think it's good as a novelty. And I didn't want to spit it out. Like I think it's fine. It's just not. Yeah. You know, the world's best whiskey. Um, so, you know, how been splitting up now and comparing whiskey's based on type, whatever. So I guess any flavored

4:36whiskey category we really only have two. I guess there's like others we've had outside of the show, but yeah, we'll have to be fair and do them all on the show. So we can have a loser's bracket of flavored whiskey. And see what that. What wins that? I can tell you that fireball is pretty far down the line for me. That stuff is gross. Yeah. It's meant to when you're dead, keep your insides preserved so that you can have a funeral or whatever you're doing. And that's kind of it. I've seen the like gym beam like green apple or something before, but I did I dare not try it. Yeah, we used to do a lot of um, like cherry whiskey and mix it with coke. That was pretty good.

5:17Okay. I mean, good for like college and yeah, we don't know what good whiskey is. Like yeah, this isn't good whiskey. It's been masked by both this cherry flavor and coke is what you mean. I wonder what this would be like with coke. That would be interesting. It's actually on their website. I looked earlier. They're like, we recommend having this with coke or like they had a few like cocktail options. Yeah. Okay. Reasonable. Maybe I'd look at that and do some like banana e cocktail. But in that realm of things, which include this disgusting maple one, I'm going to get this say, if I had to get a flavored whiskey, I would get this one, I think. So I guess that

5:55makes it like a seven. Yeah. Just because I mostly just don't want a flavored whiskey. But if I had to, this one's actually pretty high up there. It's tasty. Yeah. Yeah. I tend to agree. Actually, I'm a big fan of the banana flavor. It's really good. It's, you know, it's basically like any other flavored spirit. But it's like got that little hint of whiskey. Like I don't know if this would be better if it were just vodka and bananas. But it's true. But I don't hate it. Probably not. I think it's good. I'll give it a seven as well. I'm pleased. I think there are a lot, lot, lot of flavored whiskeys that can be ranked way below this. So exactly. That's how I feel about it. Pretty

6:35much most flavored whiskeys I'm I shy away from. So having been forced into this one. I'm like, okay, that's not bad. I will finish this. Yeah. It's only a 40% alcohol, too. It's a little lower. Maybe if it had a little burn, I might like that. I don't know. Yeah. I mean, you could like mix this a little bit with, I don't know what you mix it with, but like make popsicles out of it. That'd be pretty yummy. Yeah. Maybe like a boozy slushy. Well, yeah, but you'd have to really water it down or something because alcohol doesn't freeze. Oh, I know. Yeah. That's what I'm saying. I don't know what to mix it with, but yeah. It could be interesting. Do you want of those like

7:14chocolate frozen bananas and then drizzle a little this over top? Give it a little. Yeah. I don't know. We'll see. Well, it's all good things. We'll have to do a follow-up show and see if either of us come up with a clever recipe with which to use this, that is a little more advanced than pour in glass consume. Yeah. I do think like having a scoop of ice cream and just mixing it up really fast, like so that it that would be pretty good, I think. Yeah. Or just drizzle, like that's a thing in some places where they will drizzle like amarros or whatever over ice cream and do that. Yeah. You take like lemon cello, right? Yeah. Drizzle that over an ice cream or

7:52so this is the way I think of that. This is a little bit like maybe this is like American Amaro in a way. Yeah. The light thing. I don't know how they put the banana in. So I'll have to dig deep into that very golden color. You're in like almost. Yeah. I have no idea. Yeah. Yeah. I'm very pleasantly surprised with this one. So. Right. That's good. Good for you. Because you made it happen. Yeah. So if anyone has suggestions, I guess no one has ever suggested, well, a couple people have suggested a few whiskeys. I can't say no one has ever. But people frequently do not. So if you have like a flavored whisky that you've found is not terrible,

8:30let us know on Twitter because we would like to add some to our lineup and try them out. Is a ship shaped code Twitter or do we have a whisky web and web not Twitter? Yeah. At ship shaped code. At ship shaped code. Thank you. Don't know. You want to talk about anything seriously? quasi-series. Talk about seriously things. Yeah. Seriously things. Seriously things. Speak about things seriously rather than jokingly. Are the things serious or just our manner of delivery serious? Why not both? Probably just the things. Yeah. I can't be held accountable for any serious discussion. Fair. You never know which way I mean it. So yeah, we're light on the tech

9:13this time as people have probably noticed 10 minutes into this podcast. We don't have a guest. So there's no specific topics that lend themselves to this episode. But I have a list of topics. And we decided that one we could talk about is conventional commits versus like labeling or other things that you use to organize your things to like make a change log do releases do all that kind of stuff. So there are definitely several tools for this both automated and manual. I know that I use release it a lot and I know that Chuck dislikes release it. I don't dislike release it. Now let me let's be clear there. I just don't want to have to physically do anything beyond

10:03opening the pull request and closing the pull request. So you mentioned here conventional commits, which is an interesting thing to like enforce language to influence change logs and to say like we have a common language, right? It's like what we have a common vernacular. But it can be real annoying because sometimes I just want to do a commit that is like random experiment. Not sure squash it down later and who cares. So I like having the PR description and title and stuff be kind of like this is the commit that goes into a change log. So I like the idea of labels because like here we go. Let me label this major minor patch whatever it goes in automation reads

10:45the label does its thing if that's release it cool if that's something else cool. I kind of like that part of it like we've used it using not being able to get release it to work for me and automation has been the annoying part. Yeah, I think I want to say that release it could do those things, but I don't fully understand why because we use I believe it's like learn a change log something with release it. So it will generate the change log for you, right? And it'll say what's breaking what's not. So if it has those labels and it knows there's a breaking change, why does it not make that leap to auto increment the version to a major version, you know?

11:31Yeah, I think there's some GitHub actions that can do some of that. I'm not sure that there's some like command line tools that can do that, but I believe I haven't tried to implement, but I think I've seen GitHub actions that will read the pull request labels and then kind of knows some things what to do. Like when you merge, it's part of CI and it's going to say great, I'm going to do a release here. So are those like custom things or is it like a, is it a semantic release bot or something? That's the one I think most people use, right? You know, I'm talking about. Yeah, I think so. So it's going to like that. Yeah, the semantic release is going to increment

12:12your version in that way and then also do the release like for that. Yeah, based on your tag or whatever. And what does this new one you sent me one earlier? Did you read much about that or did you just find it? No, I think I saw it in hacker news recently. It is pretty new, but I liked it was just called release and then there was like some funny in the like show hacker news thing about oh release, sweet release. It does use like a conventional commits spec. It will run publishing script. It seems similar. It analyzes commits since the last published release determines next package version based on conventional commits spec. And so it does conventional commits is

12:52like we're still kind of relies on humans and humans typing strings in the language we all agreed on. But like, yeah, what if somebody goes rogue? You know, yeah, I'm not a big fan of conventional commits because it adds a lot of noise to your commit log because it's like chore bug or I guess not bug fix like whatever all the and I never remember what all the things are. Yeah. And then it's like if you want to get the thing right and you use the wrong one, like I had some problems with this with a client where everything was automated, right? So if you use the wrong thing, it'll release the wrong type of version. Like I think I used fix where it was supposed to be like

13:32a minor version instead or something and then it like that threw us off and we had to like do another manual release afterwards or something. So I kind of like that check of I'm running it manually. I can see it's going to be this version. Go ahead and do your thing. Yeah. But bus syndrome on that is pretty bad. Yeah. I mean, that's part of my personality is just I like to be in charge of things, right? So I should probably get better about figuring out what types of automation I could do for those things. You know, to quote someone that we heard this today and she mentioned it before is just bear in mind everything you say yes to doing. You're saying no to something else.

14:14So that's fine if you prioritize that. Yeah. Right? So you're going to take the time to check and do a release and blah blah blah and whatever else. But guess what? You could be just doing something else. True. You're like, my fix is in. I'm going to take this next 10 minutes and pivot change context, make an espresso. Who knows? Yeah. So I'll just quit all the things and open a whiskey library then. We don't have to worry about it anymore. Maybe that's it. Hey, we should open Middleburg's first whiskey library. I don't know if Middleburg is the best place for it. We'll come back to this and whatnot. Okay. Okay. Okay. Go to the pin in it. Yeah. But let's see what else

14:50what did we just talking about here? It's funny. That wasn't quite the smackdown that you thought it was going to be. Yeah. We're going to argue about this thing. I think we agree with each other's points on both sides is kind of the it's not a completely polarizing thing. It's just different preferences. I just think that you are different than a lot of engineers in that you're like, I want to touch and do all the things for all 16 jobs. Just want to do it myself and make sure it gets to the end and other engineers are like, what script can I write to like never do this again? Yeah. So in terms of change logs though, so the one new one that you had found that

15:28release one said it uses just GitHub release notes and does not generate change logs. Like when you find a new repo or I guess maybe not a new repo because you don't care about what changed, but a repo you've been using, right? And you want to update the version. Do you go to the release first or the change log first? I think it depends. I mean, I think I'm more apt to out of habit to go through a change log at the root, right? And I don't have to read it on GitHub. It's the other thing, right? I can read it locally and pull master or main and then read right there. That's kind of nice. I also, you know, GitHub actions can be useful. They're hard to build and test and

16:10all that kind of stuff. But in the end, it's like kind of nice having some of that co-located. But there are parts to me now that like our entire ecosystem is within Microsoft now. Like we would pick up all these tools and use the ease of use of that. And so it's not like it's not really system agnostic and I do prefer, I can't be like, why can't I do some stuff and get lab or spin up my own git lab or I don't know. It feels like I'm getting very tied into the only way I can do work is in this way. Yeah. And that's where I have a challenge. So in that sense, like it's not hard or bad to like go into the GitHub release and read stuff there. And I've

16:53done that before if I don't see a change log at the root or whatever. But now I'm very tied into GitHub, you know, organizes their app in a particular way and you have to go there to do it. And if I push, you know, if I push my repo somewhere else, for example, for whatever reason, well, I'm kind of not now unlocked. I'm locked into that system. Yeah. So that's probably my only negative against that. So prefer the change log. Yeah. Because I want to just read it locally. So I have several reasons I prefer the change log. I think one is similar to what you were saying. I'm just used to it. Like that's where everyone had it before. So I check the root and it's usually

17:35there. What people have been doing recently, which is super annoying to me, just because I have to do multiple clicks, is like, they have a change log and you click it and it says go to releases for release notes. And I'm like, well, if you just didn't have the change log, I would have art like by default checked the releases. So now I have to click multiple times. Yeah. But what I hate about releases is you go in right and say this library has like 10 versions. And I'm on an app that hasn't been updated in five years. So we're on version two. I'm going to have to page through the releases for like a long time to get back to where I was. See what the breaking

18:12changes for version three are. Page back to four. See what the breaking changes are there. Page back. Whereas the change log, I can just scroll and see it all and it's right there. Yeah, it's a lot more searchable to, right? Like we just want to search and try trying to jump to. Yep. Yeah. That's another good case. Although I've seen ones where like the change log is only the read most recent release. And then there's like a second file where it has the rest of them. It's a little weird. Yeah. That I wonder if that's an artifact from I honestly forget what we used to use before release it. But there was a, I think it was like GitHub change log generator or

18:51something like that. And it you had your existing change log was like a different. I forget what it was called. But then when you would generate it would like copy that contents and add the new one and make a new file or something. So maybe it's something with that. I don't know. Yeah, I'm not sure. I don't know why that gets better. Like you just can't append to in perpetuity, but I don't know. But yeah, I think it's super annoying also when like people with the, I guess it's not Ember specific. So any mono repo where you have a change log, right? So you have your root, which is going to have a change log, which is going to say go to the package and look at the change log.

19:32Right. Which is super annoying. But I guess makes sense if you had enough packages. It doesn't make sense in the Ember context because your add-on is just a one package. But you have these other packages for like testing and docs. So I don't care about their change log. I'd only want the root one to be the thing I care about. But that's just your context. So maybe someone else's story is different there. Yeah. No, anything I ever say is like I'm probably in the minority on and I'm just not correct. But that's fine. It's my opinion. Yeah. I mean, way to find out that we're going to have to write an app in fresh on Deno or Deno. It's Deno, right? Because it's the little

20:12dinosaurs in mascot. Deno. Yeah. Yeah. But it's an E, right? It's like Deno. Deno. Yeah. How is Deno from the cartoon spilled? What cartoon? The Flintstones. Deno is the dog. That's why it's the little, I always thought it was just Dino. Like Dino, but Deno. It might be, I don't know. Let's see. Google knows. I'm checking. We really got into somewhat not quickly on that one. But yeah, fresh. So fresh is like supposed to be super fast and very next like. Yeah, it is D-I-N-O. So yes, Deno should be Deno, but whatever. Okay. So anyway, I think I've seen some talks with the guy who made it. So I think Deno is how he says it. What's he know? Made

21:01this thing. Somebody else makes other things. I don't know. Yeah. It's just node with the letters rearranged. Yes. Exactly. But yeah, fresh. You're going to do some fresh, fresh with hooks or star beam. To fresh with star beam. Yeah. What is fresh? You send it and I read it and I already forgot. It is another framework, but it's. Well, I know that. Yes. And it's set up with people have been talking about it. I don't know that much about it. Is it like Astro where it's like? No, no. Trying to not ship JavaScript? No, it's definitely not that. It's a next-generation web framework. Build for speed, reliability, and simplicity. It says zero.js is sent to the client by default.

21:42Hmm. Well, then there you go. So it's partially like Astro. Yeah, because it's got the island hydration thing. But partially more like remix or something, I think. Like they do no.js is shipped to the client because a shitload of JS runs on the server. Right. I think is what they're saying. And then instead of using like node or yarn, it's using Dino. Yeah. Beno Dino. I don't know what to say or think anymore. I mean, it's got a lemon. So it does look very fresh. And you can add a minimum build a counter where if you hit plus or minus, it changes the number. That's all I know about it. Right. Not your typical to-do application, for example. Yeah. But I mean, I don't know.

22:29It's interesting, does dynamic routing, which I like that. I mean, the whole as our friend Charles said recently, the whole like the problem with React is everything is a component. Like my router is a component. My state handlers component. I don't know. It's like too much. Yeah. Get off my lawn. Yeah. I like having a little structure. So I don't know. I would have to see some of these docs. They do have, let's see, creating a route. Is there a component? It's just this shows pre-act. I'm guessing you could use React as well. So it's, yeah, they're just components. I mean, yeah, they're functions. So is it a component? I don't know. I guess. I don't think so. Dynamic route is just,

23:09oh, it's in a routes folder versus pages, but it utilizes your structure as automatic routing. So routing pages, more information about dynamic routes. Yeah. I mean, it seems all good. I say use effect and use state amount done. But you don't have to use state them. I mean, your app will still run with that. So if you thought about it and wanted to use some other state management pattern and package, then you could do that. So do this and star beam and see when you get. Yeah. No, I'm open to trying it. I mean, I think there's just so many choices. It's hard to figure out, like, unless you go with the big players that you've heard of, like next

23:49or remix or whatever people are really, really on board for all the others, we would have to try out. And I have no idea how they work. Yeah. I mean, it's hard to say they just, they come out too fast for us to be able to try them. Yep. And even if they didn't, we don't have the time to try them. Right. Exactly. Give me six months. Still not enough time. We'll just have when we build this new co-working app, we'll have different employees all do a different framework and build like a hello world app thing for like getting us started on this. And then we'll see what the code looks like, what their speed is, what the DX is and make a decision. Perfect. Or we'll just use

24:32next JS. Yeah. And you just, you just leaked some internal R&D. I don't know anything about the app. I mean, people can know we're building one. There's a million co-working apps out there. Yeah. Which one do we use? We use optics. Optics. Purely because their dashboard does not look like trash. I mean, the optics matter. They're not kidding. Yeah, no, like most of them, their marketing site is really nice. Like if you sign up as a user, your experience is really nice within the person managing the space. It's like 1995 HTML and CSS like terrible garbage look like impossible to use. Very like power user,

25:15heavy. So like it might have more features, but unless you have a like 500 person co-working space, like some people may, you know, I want the nice fresh look and like, yeah, this should look nice and I should enjoy being there. Yeah, it's true. So you don't want to write it in Drupal. No, definitely not. Turns out, fair enough to yourself. Although Drupal uses Shepard, no. So, yeah, no hate. So we support Drupal. Yeah. I used to work for Aquila. It's very complex CMS. That's all. Yeah. That's really that statement is very complex CMS where you like, there's a lot of onboarding and designing your entities. Yeah. I would love a project where I need to use

25:55one of these new CMSs like Contentful or I always get it confused. Is it Prisma is the like GraphQL thing, right? And then Prisma is just an ORM or whatever the data thing. Yeah. Prisma Mick, I believe, is the CMS. Right. I think that's true. Let me check. There's a new one that's open source content. It's like Contentful headless open source though. Let's see here. Yeah, Prisma Mick is the one. Yeah. So yeah, there's a few that that seem pretty cool, but I just haven't had a use case for it. Like you would need a like a static marketing site kind of that you need people to be able to edit the content or something and I haven't really had that.

26:42You know what I did see today and I'm not overly excited about this is a slight tangent is that they released the Chevy Blazer EV. What do you think about that? Just like on the surface. What's the Blazer? Is that the little truck? No, it's not a truck. It's an SUV and I'd say it's a mid-size SUV typically. Everyone has like 15 mid-size SUVs. So it's hard to keep track of them. Does it have a third row? I guess not if it's mid-size. That's a great question. I don't know. I mean, they lost me pretty early on. I like looked at it. The design is very futuristic by the way. I like it. Payload CMS, boys and girls and they them. Anyone else interested? That's the CMS

27:31that is supposed to be very contentful like, but it is open-source. Oh yeah, this Blazer EV looks like trash. I was being nice. I'm like, it's not for me. That's all that's just not for me. So as you know, I'm opinionated about most things and my opinion of SUVs is they should be SUVs. This is like, and okay, I haven't looked at more than what came up in the first few images in Google. So maybe I don't know, but it looks to me like a really stretched out station wagon, like not very tall, you know, very mid-sized and stretched. We took a car and we kind of stretched it out to kind of call it an SUV because we wanted to have better range and we don't want it to be

28:16like a full-on tall SUV that you could actually comfortably sit in and carry stuff in. Because we care about the range and we care about like whatever, like for whatever restrictions they have. I want someone to just come in and say, I got this huge SUV. I don't care what the range is. Like if I need to, I'll just bolt a ton of batteries on or whatever. It's just full size. I can carry things in it. I can carry people in it. Everyone sits comfortably. It's not like, oh, this third row has like two inches of leg room or like, you know, whatever. Like just make the thing fit people and stuff. Okay. It's not hard. Well, you know, I'm going to address that. But

28:53I want to first counter that with. So what you're admitting is that the Model X Tesla Model X is not an SUV. It's a minivan. Oh, it's 100% not an SUV. Yeah, it's a minivan. It's not anything. Really, it's a car that they stretched a tiny, tiny bit. Like if you park it next to even someone's mid-sized SUV like a blazer or whatever, it looks tiny. It is a car. It is not an SUV. They just figured out a way to put more seats in the back with no leg room and say, oh, yeah, it's an SUV. You could just like, yeah, there's no. They did that so that it was a marketing distinction to say like we're the first electric SUV and like we're all these awards for SUV, but it's not an SUV. Yeah, exactly.

29:39There may be some sport to it, but marginal utility. Yes. Right. So it test drove a Rivian, but it was the R1T, not the R1S. This past weekend, yeah, they don't, this is aren't delivered here yet. Or like it really anywhere. Apparently they're delivering in the next couple of months. So like the first ones, but they won't be in Phoenix. They'll probably be in California. After they started deliveries on them, I think it was like two or three months in, they delivered one to like their chief marketing officer or something. And I went, okay, if it's months in and you're just getting it to this person, it's going to be a long time before

30:20we get one. So the emails we got say that, but like, oh, next year, anytime, like first half, six months, you know, but the people at the service center delivery center, at least here in Phoenix, they seem to feel like they are scaling up production. So deliveries are going to really start to happen more in like the next couple of months. Not necessarily for me more for like California and stuff. And then like, so they are delivering them. Just there's a bigger list of people wanting them, I guess, than we thought, maybe there's a real big list. And then they're trying to like, so there's different things to that help you in production batches. It's sort of

31:00like, okay, I'm in the Southwest. I got white with a black interior and the the middle battery and this package, that's going to be faster than if you got the ocean interior or if you shift some other stuff, certain colors and stuff. So they're batching them or scaling up production, batching them out and then going like that. So she seems to think like late this year, early next year, is about when we probably expected. Yeah. So my problem is I really like what they have. I think they have gone way, way, way too fast, even though they're really slow. Like they haven't paid attention to the detail from a marketing perspective. So like you go to their website, nothing says

31:40the little thing like on the armrest in the middle is an induction charger, but it is. Like I would want to see more step through of like all these cool things, but they don't highlight that. They're like, here's a picture of it. You can buy it if you want. Like, I think they're missing the point on a lot of things. And I think someone like Range Rover or something, if they redesigned their whole thing to be EV, have some cool stuff like that, call it out and make their price point not that much higher. Right. Dead. Like, why would you ever buy something from someone who hasn't made cars ever versus someone that's made cars for decades? Yeah. Well, that aside, and if

32:19somebody comes to markets sooner or perhaps, you know, that would challenge this, but I think you are going to really like it. Oh, what? It's roomy. It's big. It drives like the thing that my wife doesn't like about it. She's like, it's really like a very detailed and well thought out. And there's so much space and everything else, but it drives a lot like a truck. That's what you want. Like, right. It's a truck. Yeah. Right. So, you know, we have a Q7 and it's like, you know, it's got capacity, but it's more sporty and that kind of thing. And she's like, this drives like a truck, but it can do the crabwalk circle thing. No, it can't. That's been disabled. Oh, it can't.

32:56Yeah, tank turn. So it's got a tank turn. And apparently there was some, I don't know. She said that they got because it kind of destroys the ground when it does that. So they got some like push back on it. So it's been software disabled. Okay. So we can functionally jailbreak it and turn it back on. Yeah, exactly. Because that was definitely a selling point. But like, they are really, so it's roomy. It's powerful. I mean, the zero to 60 is very serious. I think it's like three seconds. And it was, do you feel like you're sitting in a living room? No, it's not 100 big. I don't mean real big. I mean like your legs instead of being like kind of straight out or like 100%

33:3590 degree angle sitting up. Like, you know what I mean? Like sitting in a real chair versus a car. Yeah, I would say that. That's pretty high. I mean, you can adjust obviously the air suspension anywhere from like, I think nine and a half inches is the lowest in sport mode. And then an off-road mode, it goes all the way up to like 15 inches. So it's got pretty decent clearance. I think it's 11 and a half or it's just standard all road height. Do you going to adjust a lot of that stuff? It's got 19 speakers. Well, so the stereo system is like pretty crazy and nice. So much storage. You were talking about like that center console. Like a woman could put a regular size person there.

34:11Easily story person. Does it have like a bunch of layers of like things that move around in there for the storage or is it just one big hole? It's kind of just one big hole. Okay. Because the the model X has like that big hole is covered with your like cup holders and stuff. Oh yeah. And they like slide out of the way. And then you have the big hole. No, the cup holders kind of like pop out of the front. You just push and they'll pop out of the thing in the front. The like under the back seat. You can lift like part of the back seat up and you have storage there. You have like so much storage capacity all over this thing. On board air compressor. It's pretty pretty decent

34:47size. The truck has a lot of cool stuff. Like I don't know if this one had all the options and stuff. Like you can get the kitchen. You can get like yeah. I guess it's not an option. Everything has like the like air compressor in the back. The like plugs for things. Yeah. Both will have those things. The SUV won't have the slide through storage. I don't think. But like the truck has that right. It will not. And then that's where you put the camp kitchen and some other stuff if you wanted. You actually in the truck like the the middle arm comes down and you have like a slide door to access that storage compartment too. Like say you put a cooler back there or something. You

35:24have access to it from the truck but the SUV won't have that because it's you know I got to seats and everything else. So did the truck have a second row of seats? Yeah. How were they? Did you check those out? Yeah. Very comfortable. So the second row is fine. Super comfy. Tons of space there. So I would imagine the third row would have pretty decent. It looks like from online. Well, the third row is not super important. The third row mainly for us is for our dogs. Right. Like they need somewhere to sit. So yeah, they'll have tons of space in that. Yeah, plenty. Yeah. And I mean, they're small dogs too. So yeah, let's be honest. You could tell some of the

36:01back of like a Q4 and be fine too. Yeah. But they they're spoiled. They like seats. Right. Let's fare. And we got to see a couple of different colors too. So I saw like kind of this slate grade. It almost looks like a jet fighter color but then shiny. And then saw the the forest interior whatever it is like a green interior. That's what we got for our interior. Nice. It looks cool. I did like it online, but in person I was like, Oh, this is cool. Okay. Yeah. I can see where this works. We leaned into the like this is for camping kind of style. Like we did that interior. We did green outside. And we did the tent on top. Wow. Like full on camp mobile. Yeah. See that?

36:45You camp. Not with a baby, but we did before prior to baby. Okay. When he's a little bit older and can like maybe walk around and stuff like we probably camp. Yeah. Well, yeah. The green is cool. And they have these they're called chillwitch mats. I don't know how to describe them, but I think they're like a bamboo like material and it's like a neat pattern and stuff on there. And this will be like easy to clean and all that. It was all really nice. It just seemed really well thought out. Yeah. See that's back to what I was saying. I think they have like done a really great job engineering it and thinking of that stuff. But they've done a really poor job of telling me that

37:21that stuff is there, you know? Right. Yeah. I think all that's coming. They've got so much demand that it doesn't matter. So like until they hit a law of demand, why would you care about beefing up your marketing site and highlighting everything? Like I get it. But I wish I knew more about those things without having to go see one. Well, I'm glad that we bullied them into letting us see and drive one because they're not going to let you. I mean, I asked initially because Sarah was getting a little itchy and we were driving some other stuff and gas prices up and everything else made her feel like maybe we should make a decision here. And really ultimately,

37:58you know, we drive the e-tron and okay, it's Audi. I know. It's just, I know what I like. I like this. This is fine. Maybe I won't even like that or the thing. Let's find out. Right. And I asked and they were like, well, not until we know your delivery window gets closer and then you do that. And I'm like, yeah, but I really need to. And I think they should. Like people will cancel if you don't let them see. Yeah, I wish I knew how many pre-orders there were. Like if it's 500,000, maybe they don't give a shit. They're like, you know, 50,000 people cancel. I don't care. Like, yeah, it doesn't matter. Well, they also just can't say 50,000 people can come do a test drive.

38:34I think they have been a slight barrier to entry there. Like you ask, they say, hmm, we're not not yet. And then you ask again, a little stronger than like, okay. Yeah. I don't know. We're pretty excited about it because I think Caitlin has been watching like videos of people who have gotten them and, you know, different stuff and seeing there's a lot of cool stuff. And like, that's how I've learned about some of these cool things that they don't highlight at all. If you like go to the, there's even like a bulleted feature thing of the interior. And it doesn't mention that it's an induction charger. But like if you go to that picture and look at like the

39:08captured in the picture, I think something alludes to it's a charger. It doesn't even say straight up. It's a charger. But it's like place for phone like electrified or I don't know something like it's that's funny. Yeah. Because right away when we got in, they were like, oh, see your phone here. There you go. It charges. Yeah. It's one of the things they highlight in person at least are for us. Yeah. And that's a big deal. Like I love having places like that. And you don't have to have cords and it's nice. Yeah. It does not have car play as of now. Well neither does the Tesla. So I won't be missing it. All right. Fair enough. I don't think it's like the end of the world.

39:44But it is kind of nice. Yeah. Does it have, is there a Spotify app for like the Rivian? You know, like because if it has that, it's all I need. Yeah. It has the Spotify app integrated. Yeah. Good to go there. And I do think there's an appeal to being like a part of the early adopters club. Kind of cool. Yeah. And we're grandfathered into the old pricing. By the time we get it, I'm sure it'll be like 200 grand for a vehicle. Right. Exactly. I know. I almost said to Sarah like we should just get it and flip it. We still make yeah. Like I don't think we're going to cancel ours even if we decide we're going to get something else because I do think you'll be able to flip it

40:19pretty easily. So right. Yeah. It seems kind of worthwhile. Yeah. Oh, regardless. It was a nice experience. It seems pretty cool. If you like the feel of a truck, it feels like that. The regeneration is pretty strong on it though. Like very serious. Like you don't need to touch break it all. You just have to really be careful how much you're feathering the accelerator. Yeah. I was about to say gas, but that doesn't exist. That's how the Tesla is. Yeah. I mean, mine has that regen too, but not to like this degree. Like this was like, you know, jerk you so strong. Yeah, it's pretty bad. I think it's adjustable on the Tesla, but I think we probably have it on max

40:57or whatever. And yeah, I never use the brake basically unless there's like something runs on the front of you and you need to really, really stop, you know, which makes it hard when I'm driving the truck because it has the complete opposite. You have got to like put all of your weight onto the brake or you're not going to stop. Yeah. You don't have like power assist brakes or you probably have no sure you don't have power steering. So no, I do have power steering. Really? But I don't, I don't have power brakes. So the brakes are really, really tough. Someone at some point decided they hated life enough to put in power steering. Right. Yeah. That's very opposite

41:31to like some of the, are they drum brakes? The rear is in the front is disc. At least that could be worse. Yeah. Yeah. No, it's, it's better like before it, it didn't stop like at all and they updated some of that and it now is just really hard to stop. Right. Make you work for it. Do you want to live? There's no chance of falling asleep driving in that thing though. That's true because you got to do a lot of work. Yeah. Okay. Massage seats are an option in some cars. I don't get that, you know? Have you tried one? No, because if I'm on a drive where I feel like I need a massage, I feel like that's just going to make things worse. Okay. So yes, for the driver's seat, not a great idea.

42:14For the passenger seat, awesome. Like my dad's truck has it and I would just like, he had me test drive it because he bought it from like somewhere up here. I don't really remember why, but I had to go drive it around and make sure it was a truck. So I did and I turned the seats on and like that's yielded for me. I was like, I don't care anything else about this. Like this has massage seats and you should buy this because I'm going to be the passenger. Yeah. Yeah. It is missing a really important thing, which I didn't think about on a test drive. It doesn't have front sensors. So like it has the rear backup sensors, but it doesn't have front ones. Right. And it's like why

42:55in this day and age would you not just have sensors everywhere so that I can park easily and I don't know. How did people do it? 10 years ago. I mean, maybe they just stopped before they hit the wall. You had to look where you're going. Yeah. It's crazy. Backup cameras are a game changer. I can remember like the first time I got a car with a backup camera. Now previously, I remember saying, I don't know, whatever. I can just park. I don't need those things. I can park. I got skill driving skills. And then you get a backup camera and you're in like a big city trying to fit into a little space. And it's a game changer. Oh, like spaces I would have skipped. I would

43:34have been like, nah, can't do that. Yes, I can. I got this camera. Yeah. Which I was hoping the auto park on the Tesla would do well at that. But it never comes up as an option. I like pull up right next to the parallel parking spot. And like nothing happens. And then people are like waiting on me. I'm like, sorry. I got like manually parked now. And Elon's like, nah, I'm out. Yeah. I don't know what that is. I do think they've like dumbed some things down after lots of like automated crashes where they're like, no, no, no, we want to be really, really sure that like, you can actually do the thing before we let you do the thing. Right. It seems pretty reasonable.

44:08And they're like, wait, we thought this was going to learn a lot faster, apparently not. Yeah. It's a good time to take a break and say this show is sponsored by Ship Shape Motors. That's true. It has been like all about one thing thus far. If only you were making that up. Yeah. No, it can be that we do have Ship Shape Motors. But I mean, obviously we have no products or money. So it is sponsored and spirit by us to us. Yes. It seems cool. We bought these things for ourselves. Yeah. Let's pivot to anything else. What did I say earlier that you were like, put that off until later? I don't know. I said put a pin in it. That was I figured that was your

44:47job to remember at that point. We'll never know. Okay. We don't have the technology to go back until the recording is done. All right. Fair enough. I think I was telling you recently about how thanks to my brother, my family acquired a recall box, which isn't what the name implies, actually. I'm not sure what that's all about. But so it's like basically a simple OS for running game emulators and a bunch of rounds and all that stuff. It's not a memory test as the name implies. No. Yeah. Can you recall? Do you recall when you used to play these games? Yeah. So the Atari 2600 all the way up to I think we have like PS1 or something. But we our sweet spot is Super Nintendo.

45:31Yeah. Mostly that a little in 64. A lot of good Super Nintendo games really are. The starter for all of it is my wife wanted to play Aladdin on Super Nintendo, which who realized that was a thing. I don't know. I never played that one. There's a lot of stuff you'd never heard of on all the Nintendo's though. Oh, for sure. Yeah. I mean, there's a lot of options when Super Nintendo was out my age. I was like teenager. So I wouldn't have been playing Aladdin. I was playing stuff like Super Star Wars and Chrono Trigger. Got to play Mario, right? Yeah. I always play the Mario. Castlevania's. I kind of have a soft bug for the Castlevania's. So it's a pretty cool thing.

46:12It's the only annoying part has been like the controller configuration stuff every single time. So it's like, oh, initially we got some plug-in controllers and then my son was like yanking it out all the time. So then we got a Bluetooth one. It kind of looked like the old school ones, but then getting it configured. So like a pain in the butt and then you like, oh, you have to go into a game and it's not working. You reboot the whole thing. But now we found our happy place. And yeah, it's been good. Nice. You ever heard of a game called Bubble Bubble? No. Bubble Bubble. There's a little dyno and he blows bubbles and then like the bad guys come and get you and it

46:49kind of looks like old school Donkey Kong in a way. So it's like instead of the barrels rolling. It's like these guys are coming at you and you bubble them and then you jump on them and then they turn into fruit or vegetables. And then get that. Get your points. Go to the next level. Interesting. It's kind of weird. Yeah, most of the games that I played were the original Nintendo. I never had the SNES, but I played the, I forget the names were like the Mario World ones where you go around to the different levels and like those were really fun on Super Nintendo. But on original, I used to play like a set of the like five games that would actually play because it

47:28like always broke. So it was like Super Mario 3 was like a classic. That was really good. Skate or die. Did you ever play that? Yes. Totally played that. Yeah, because I was a skater and back in the day. Yeah, that was pretty fun. Ninja Turtles was pretty fun and star tropics. Was the one game I think that I bought new like wrapped up. I don't remember where from, but like I got it new. So it worked really well. Whereas the others were really old and like died on me a lot. Those and all the Mario games obviously were really good. Yeah, you're like I'm on Nintendo. I'm going to get their stuff Zelda. Did you never played the first Zelda?

48:13I actually funny story did not like the original couple Zelda's on NES. But I got back in in 64 with Ocarina time. Obviously amazing. So like I played that and then since then was a Zelda fan and played all the old ones and liked them and stuff. But yeah, I don't know. I just I didn't like the format I guess of like, I don't know. I don't remember why I didn't like it because I played the same ones were like released for Game Boy and stuff. And I played those then and liked them. But I didn't like them on NES for whatever reason. Well, I mean, there was probably some time and maturity in between the time when you first played it. And then when you got to experience

48:52it on a different platform. Yeah, that's true. Yeah. They even have them like remastered in 3D on like Switch now like the links Awakening and stuff. Yeah, I heard that. Yeah, I have that one. It's pretty good. Nice. Yeah, I haven't done back to Switch in a while. Got too many games on recall box now. It's seriously. There's a lot of games there. Can't go back. Although what game and I can am I going to play while my family's on that? Well, you play the Switch while they're occupied. Yeah, that's how we that's how we went because I did pick up Tony Hawk's pro skater. Oh, the original one. Yeah, one and two are on the Switch now.

49:29It's like a remastered for the Switch. So that's kind of fun. Although I don't know how to do any of those things anymore. Did they update? I remember one, I think it was one didn't have reverts and two maybe did. I don't know if they changed that like for the remaster. Yeah, I don't know. You'll have to look that up in here. But that was the thing is you couldn't do big combos because when you landed off the pipe, you couldn't revert and continue your combo because that wasn't enabled. So it was like, you know, you could only maybe do like five tricks max for like a combo or something. Unless you're doing infinite grinds around something or whatever. Yeah, that was

50:04the big hack. You didn't grind. I don't know. That's a great question. I got it and then I've only played it like for a brief amount of time. Did you ever play Dave Mira? I didn't. Was that the BMX one, right? Yeah. Yeah. I think I was one of the like 10 people that bought it. Yeah. But poor Dave, it was pretty good. It's just not as cool, I guess, like being on a bike versus a skateboard. I mean, I respect that. I just I guess it just never got as popular. I don't know. Yeah. Yeah, there's been a couple of really interesting Tony Hawk documentaries too over this year. So there was like a docu series and then a different documentary. One of them was on HBO.

50:45So it was pretty good. Recommended. They did some like power all to stuff. So Tony Hawk was in I think DC sometime recently. He like went to something and then just like went to escape park and just showed up like, what's up? I'm Tony Hawk and just like hung out and did cool stuff. I'm Tony Hawk and I'm in my 50s. I'm going to show you how it's done. And I'm still way better than you could ever be at any age. Yeah. I think he's like technically as far as competitions and stuff, even still better than his son. Yeah. That's embarrassing. That's tough. Boy, you ain't got enough drive. Yeah. Like by the time his son can beat him, he's like 75 and like

51:29using a walker to like get onto the board. Then once he gets airborne, stop at him. That's like we've seen those videos of that guy that like dresses up like an old guy and goes to like muscle beach and works out. Yeah. Wasn't that Johnny Knoxville? Wasn't that a whole jackass thing where he would pretend to be the old guy? I don't remember where it was from but it was just funny. He's like, hey, I'm old. He's like, then he squats like tons of weight. Right. Yeah. Surprising everyone. I have seen those skits. Pretty funny. Are there lots of things going on around you? There are. They're putting an octopus on my door

52:07right now. Are they really? Yeah. Real time. Did you order a sign or something? I didn't. They just offered it to everyone. They're like, do you want your logo on the door and yeah, now I have it. And they like printed it and did it. Yeah. Nice. And then a man just putting it on right now. Live. But it won't be live. We need when other people listen to this. It won't be live. Yeah. Many weeks from now, many weeks ago is when it was put on. Yeah. Happened just in time. So yeah. Anyway, games. Yeah. I have been continuing pretty much only playing Destiny in terms of like electronic games played some poker recently with some friends at the lake.

52:53And immediately got demolished within like 20 minutes, bought back in and also lost all that money within like another 20 minutes. Because I always forget which hands win. So I'm like, I get like all in. I get like two pair and I'm like, okay, no one's beating me. Like two pairs is the best hand you can get. And then like three other people have flushes. And I'm like, okay, I'm sorry. I should not have bet. That's funny. Where are you playing Texas Hold'em? Seven car studs. Like. Yeah. Hold'em. Gotcha. No wind. Fold'em. No wind. Good way. So we play for like really low amounts of money. Like you buy in for like 25 bucks and you get

53:39$2,500 worth of chips. So it's like, you know, this is what I would spend on one hand of Blackjack at a casino. Right. So I'm just like yolo with like every hand because it doesn't matter, you know. Oh boy. I used to kind of know how to play poker for a bit, you know, obviously when I was in that world, I read a couple books around like specifically like knowing statistics based on what your hand is, what where you are in the turn, where you're seated from the dealer, all of those kinds of things. Yeah. And then based on those things, you would make different choices. Yeah. I don't remember all that stuff anymore. I do it all wrong because I know like so there'll

54:23be several times like everyone checks like no one raises all the way around several hands in a row. You should probably just like all in because like clearly no one has anything. But what if they're lying, you know, like because that's the hard thing is baiting people into that so that then you can take all their money because right. Yeah. And now those circumstances, you're supposed to be watching the people and the people are watching you and you would only check because you see like oh, Robbie has a big smile on his face. He probably has a pretty good hand, but I have a great hand. Yeah. So let's let him feel good and then you check and I, you know, my brain is not powerful enough

55:02to do that. Hold your smiles back. No, to like strategize like that. I just, you know, I bet all over the place. I might have a good hand. I might not, but it's never very strategic. It's just like, yeah, I feel like going all in. Yeah. And it's like our people willing to pay to find out whether you're full of crap or not. If they do, they find out you are. Yeah. The fun thing is to take the first hand assuming you're not the blinds and just immediately all in. Like don't even see the cards and like then people are like, wait, what? And like everyone will usually fold that first time because it's like, what the fuck? Like, why would you do that? And then, but then it doesn't work

55:42in subsequent turns. Yeah. Right. You can't like bully people out of every single hand. Yeah. I mean, I guess you could try, but it doesn't work as someone inevitably has a flush or something and wins. Yeah. Yeah. Like a pair of bases right off the bat or something like pretty good before you even see. Yeah. I don't know. Sure. We'll play some poker sometime. Sounds like to me. I love gambling. I don't have patience for it though. I tell you, like I would go and I'd have friends that can go spend eight, 12 hours playing. I'm like, I just can't. I play a couple of hours and then I get bored. And then I'm finally like, all in. I just want to leave. I mean, they're

56:20going to leave with money or not. Yeah. It's a little different though. Like I could play Blackjack for all day, especially the ones with the side bets because like you can put like five bucks there and it's like if you're two cards and like the dealers card make like a straight or a flush or a different stuff, like you get a bunch of extra stuff. So you can bet like the minimum on the main bet and you make like 50 times your bet on the side bet. So you can just play all day on the side bet. Yeah. I don't know. I did not ever deal and replace the did that and I would hate to keep track of it. It's unhorrible. It is pretty tough. And several times I have to be like,

57:00hey, no, I actually like made a bunch of money here like give me that money because like the dealer cares about the Blackjack and I'm like, no, no, this we're not here to play Blackjack. We're here to play this side bet like Blackjack is just my buy-in to play this other thing. Thanks. Yeah. No, it really is. Yeah. All right. Well, we're pretty overtime and we've talked about a bunch of random stuff here. So we'll go ahead and end it. Thanks everyone for listening. If you liked it, please subscribe and I'll catch you guys next time. Thanks for listening to WhiskeyWeb and WetNot. This podcast is brought to you by Shipship

57:34and produced by podcast Royale. If you like this episode, consider sharing it with a friend or two and leave us a rating and maybe a review as long as it's good. You can subscribe to future episodes on Apple, Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts. For more info about Shipship and the show, check out our website at ShipshipShape.io. you